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<  Slavery  ~  Serving as a slave means doing what the OTHER person wants!

PostPosted: 23 Jan 2018, 17:09
User avatarSite AdminPosts: 166Location: Seattle, WAJoined: 24 Sep 2013, 19:00Status/Identification: Gorean Free Woman
Time and time again, I have had conversations with would be "slaves", who insist they want to be slaves, yet cannot seem to grasp the concept that service, and being a slave means dedicating one's life to the will of another person.

What follows is one of the more mind-boggling exchanges on this subject. The girl's nick has been redacted to protect her privacy.

Session Ident: #Gorean_Living

[17:28.06] <girl> greetings
[17:36.41] <Multitasking`Khaos> Tal
[17:36.53] <Multitasking`Khaos> Have you read the rules yet?
[17:37.37] * Multitasking`Khaos notes that the question is directed to girl
[17:39.07] <girl> yes i did read.
[17:39.43] <Multitasking`Khaos> Did you have difficulty understanding them?
[17:40.38] <+girl> i understand rules.
[17:41.35] <Multitasking`Khaos> Your nick contains the word, "kajira". I assume that means you are identifying as a slave. Is that correct?
[17:42.04] <+girl> yes Mr.
[17:42.31] <Multitasking`Khaos> It is Mistress.
[17:42.42] <Multitasking`Khaos> And if I were male, it would be Master. Not Mr.
[17:43.12] <+girl> exuse me.
[17:44.10] <Multitasking`Khaos> You said you read the rules. If that is true, then you ignored them. Is there some reason you feel you should be exempt?
[17:45.18] <+girl> my English is very poor, I know that this is not an explanation.
[17:45.47] <Multitasking`Khaos> I see. I will explain.
[17:46.51] <Multitasking`Khaos> Slaves entering must offer greetings to the free immediately on entering. Masters first, Mistresses after that, if any are present.
[17:47.46] <Multitasking`Khaos> You always address free as Master or Mistress. Do you understand this?
[17:48.03] <+girl> yes Master
[17:48.13] <Multitasking`Khaos> I told you. It is Mistress.
[17:48.18] <Multitasking`Khaos> I am a free woman.
[17:48.37] <+girl> yes Mistress.
[17:48.41] <Multitasking`Khaos> Much better.
[17:48.50] <Multitasking`Khaos> Have you been to any Gorean chat rooms before?
[17:50.47] <+girl> no Mistress
[17:51.05] <+girl> this is my first
[17:53.21] <+girl> Can I ask Mistress about somenthing?
[17:53.40] <Multitasking`Khaos> Sure.
[17:54.04] <+girl> How big is the chance to have a mentor through virtually?
[17:54.22] <Multitasking`Khaos> It depends on what you mean by a mentor.
[17:54.42] <Multitasking`Khaos> And whether you are willing to do the work, or are just looking for some kinky fun.
[17:57.57] <+girl> in my origin country not exist kinky, but i very need feels as slave.
[17:58.38] <Multitasking`Khaos> Tell me what that means to you.. Why do you feel you are a slave?
[18:00.47] <+girl> I feel that the Gor world could be my world
[18:01.47] <+girl> I feel in my heart the need for slavery, the submission of orders and it makes me happy. I could have been a slave for a few moments in my life.
[18:02.27] <+girl> I would like to belong to a man and feel that my life is in his hands.
[18:02.42] <Multitasking`Khaos> OK.. But WHY? Hav eyou examined this?
[18:02.47] <Multitasking`Khaos> have you*
[18:03.30] <+girl> because i need it. my heart need it.
[18:04.21] <+girl> my submission could be greater than what I experienced.
[18:05.27] <Multitasking`Khaos> OK. Why Gor, specifically?
[18:05.28] <+girl> I have never met a real Master's Gor. But feel that i can serve..
[18:06.19] <+girl> because Gor is magical world, law and life style is magical i read about it in book.
[18:07.17] <Multitasking`Khaos> What do you mean magical?
[18:08.01] <+girl> I would like to be adapted to slavery, be my own, and fall in love with Master, and i sacrifices life in service to him
[18:08.12] <Multitasking`Khaos> Real Goreans apply the philosophies from the books into real life. There are no stabalisation serums, tarns, spaceships, etc.
[18:09.25] <+girl> i know
[18:09.35] <Multitasking`Khaos> How many of the books have you read?
[18:10.21] <+girl> now only 2, and i read 3, but read by online too part from books
[18:12.32] <Multitasking`Khaos> Which ones?
[18:12.45] <Multitasking`Khaos> And are you saying you read online versions and not the real ones?
[18:13.19] <+girl> Slave girl of gor, transman of gor,
[18:13.42] <Multitasking`Khaos> Ahh.. That would be Tarnsman. BIG difference! LOL
[18:13.51] <+girl> i have books
[18:14.16] <Multitasking`Khaos> I suggest read them in order.
[18:14.33] <Multitasking`Khaos> Tarnsman is the first. The second one is Outlaw.
[18:15.43] <+girl> i know Mistress, but i read as i have books toread. irecpect every books. i very dificult buy in my country.
[18:15.43] <Multitasking`Khaos> It is the best way to learn of the beliefs and ways of Gor, and really, no one who is a real life Gorean and not just on line role player will teach you much if you are not actively reading the books.
[18:16.10] <Multitasking`Khaos> Can you access and buy from them?
[18:17.53] <+girl> I'm afraid that in my situation it is a bit difficult, to Iran may not want to be sent.
[18:18.31] <Multitasking`Khaos> Ahhhhh.
[18:18.56] <Multitasking`Khaos> Yes. They ban everything there!
[18:18.56] <+girl> they censor the books. :(
[18:19.06] <Multitasking`Khaos> I know.
[18:19.46] <Multitasking`Khaos> So it is definitely going to be more difficult.
[18:20.39] <+girl> i know one men who were in Usa and He knew gorean style. he did give me first book.
[18:21.55] <+girl> Mistress... I am 30 years old, I want to be submissive and live as it
[18:22.53] <Multitasking`Khaos> I would think you would be able to find men there who will accept your submission as a woman before a man.
[18:24.04] <+girl> Mistress, maybe yes, but this is style in sharia law not gorean lifestyle
[18:24.44] <Multitasking`Khaos> Well, perhaps they are not as different as you think?
[18:24.57] <Multitasking`Khaos> Tell me what you see as the differences.
[18:25.09] <+girl> law in my country not accept nudity, collars... maybe chains
[18:25.50] <Multitasking`Khaos> Not in public, no. That isn't done really in public here either though.
[18:26.22] <+girl> the whole envelope of sexuality of a woman dies in this law. when I read books, I know that true femininity is in a slave.
[18:26.49] <Multitasking`Khaos> Are women not even expected to be sensual for their husband?
[18:27.14] <Multitasking`Khaos> In private?
[18:27.27] <+girl> yes ...
[18:28.08] <+girl> man does not accept such sexuality in a woman..
[18:28.23] <Multitasking`Khaos> Not even in their own bedroom??
[18:29.52] <+girl> unfortunately...
[18:29.59] <+girl> I can not feel really submissive, I can feel an ordinary servant. but my husband will never be a master for me, no qualities, no character. here is another type of coercion.
[18:30.54] <Multitasking`Khaos> That is too bad. Do you already have a husband?
[18:31.07] <+girl> yes
[18:31.27] <Multitasking`Khaos> Have you tried to become more submissive with him
[18:31.28] <Multitasking`Khaos> ?
[18:31.37] <+girl> yes
[18:32.07] <+girl> because he is too religious, we have three children, and I have never felt like a slave in love.
[18:33.33] <Multitasking`Khaos> That is unfortunate.
[18:34.12] <+girl> my desires terrify me. I can not stop thinking about how to reconcile these two worlds. my husband does not understand my sexuality as hot as I want to live. here it is equated with the sin of liberation.
[18:34.18] <Multitasking`Khaos> However, you are married to this man. Sometimes the way you must serve your man is not the way you would rather serve.
[18:34.56] <Multitasking`Khaos> Service means pleasing HIM. Whatever that means. Not looking to please yourself.
[18:35.15] <+girl> it may be physical punishment, slavery is ... but it will not help you meet in submission. he will never do anything against me and dominate me.
[18:35.35] <Multitasking`Khaos> Even if you became kajira in real life, you might have a master that wishes you to serve him in other ways, and you may not feel in love with him.
[18:35.54] <+girl> Mistress i know it. i accept.
[18:37.23] <Multitasking`Khaos> I will tell you the same thing I have told many other women who are married and wish to serve their husbands when he does not seem to wish it..
[18:37.28] <+girl> here, women get rid of sexuality to become a thing in the body. I understand. I would like to feel naturally with someone who I serve, be open, honest, and do not hide sexuality.
[18:38.52] <+girl> these two services differ too much.
[18:39.37] <Multitasking`Khaos> They do. But what do you expect to do? Will you leave your husband and your children behind just to get what you want?
[18:39.52] <Multitasking`Khaos> And if you would, how is that the act of a slave?
[18:40.10] <+girl> I live in desires and I lie to myself. I did not manage to develop my desires and I was told to forget. I can not do much, I would risk a lot to change my life into a role of a kajra...
[18:40.37] <Multitasking`Khaos> Is it really that you wish to be a kajira and serve as a slave, or is it just that you want to be sexually free?
[18:41.31] <Multitasking`Khaos> Because a slave serves because she wishes to please her master. Not because she wishes to be pleased.
[18:42.08] <Multitasking`Khaos> There is nothing wrong with wanting to be sexually free. It is natural.
[18:42.16] <+girl> if I ran away and left my old life, I will be punished with death. but my slavery here leads me nowhere. for a year, she does not feel a woman just another piece of furniture at home, she has no right above which protects a woman. in gorean there is a right and a chance to have a second master.
[18:42.21] <Multitasking`Khaos> Slavery isn't the ansert to that though.
[18:42.35] <Multitasking`Khaos> answer*
[18:42.58] <Multitasking`Khaos> But there is no real Gor. We live it within the laws of where we live.
[18:43.43] <+girl> I want to be free, and choose the path of Gor, having a master who will create me, will protect, raise and punish me as necessary. I want to feel free with him sexually according to his principles.
[18:43.48] <Multitasking`Khaos> A slave very often IS simply furniture or a tool. She is not a "person". She is property. Like a car.
[18:45.33] <+girl> our law restricts sexuality, imposes religious principles, no human ability, my husband will never want me as a slave in bed, he will not punish and he will not do what the master can do.
[18:46.42] <+girl> I live with fantasies, I know that people live in real life. I live like a slave girl but I will never taste here, what I can read about.
[18:46.57] <Multitasking`Khaos> So you are looking for online only then?
[18:48.08] <+girl> now only online, and when the master wants me then i try to escape from here to somewhere
[18:48.28] <Multitasking`Khaos> What about your children?
[18:48.40] <Multitasking`Khaos> Are they still small or grown?
[18:48.49] <Multitasking`Khaos> Oh wait.. You said you are 30.
[18:48.56] <Multitasking`Khaos> So they can't be grown.
[18:49.17] <+girl> children belong to the father, he decides their fate. I do his commands
[18:49.33] <Multitasking`Khaos> Your most important job in this world is to be a mother to your children.
[18:49.43] <+girl> 3 old, 1 old, and 5 old.
[18:50.24] <Multitasking`Khaos> They are just babies still.
[18:51.03] <Multitasking`Khaos> Isn't that even more reason to stay there? If you escaped, you would never see them again!
[18:51.06] <+girl> I'm only at home for children :(
[18:53.06] <+girl> my husband is 60 old. i need see wolrd and to know real magical love as kajra and i not want be here
[18:54.31] <+girl> when I stop having children, there will be a divorce and I will go to the street. i no have family only husband but now he not understand me
[18:55.21] <Multitasking`Khaos> I thought divorce is not allowed unless the woman is unfaithful.
[18:56.28] <+girl> a man can divorce someday he wants a woman and have 4 wives as he pleases. In the case of a divorce, the children stay with their father.
[18:58.26] <+girl> I think that every master is better, than now my life.
[18:58.40] <Multitasking`Khaos> Why would he divorce you though?
[18:59.27] <Multitasking`Khaos> You say he would never act against you. That seems like he is kind to you, even if it is not the thing you want.
[19:02.58] <+girl> he thinks I'm not a good wife and a religious woman. he not love me , never told about love to me. even about my body
[19:03.49] <Multitasking`Khaos> Why did he marry you?
[19:04.12] <+girl> i dont know
[19:06.27] <+girl> I need sexuality, the slave's passion for the master, I started to write poems
[19:08.37] <+girl> I wanted to live like in a book, I even looked for a master here, someone who will develop me, unfortunately he does not even want to give me back to another man.
[19:11.43] <+girl> i read that in gor has no idea of ​​sin. is the love of naturalness and beauty and of man, why I have to hide my sexuality and not feel naturally, even at home because she is called infidel and unbelieving.
[19:14.37] <+girl> Mistress.. if someone wanted to give me the chance of freedom, I would be the happiest person I gave up for the master.
[19:18.13] <Multitasking`Khaos> I don't know how to help you.
[19:19.24] <Multitasking`Khaos> What you are looking for is not slavery. Slavery is what you have. You do not like it. You are looking for freedom. For the ability to do as you please.
[19:20.16] <Multitasking`Khaos> I empathise with you and wish that you could have that freedom in your country. It is not fair or right that you do not. Gor is not the solution to your problem though.
[19:24.38] <+girl> I want freedom in being a woman. I have already taken everything away. crippled but I do not want to write about it in general.
[19:29.26] <+girl> I do not believe Mistress in my ability to serve. I am ready to receive any other service and physical punishment, I only want to feel as a woman, though a slave.
[19:32.09] <Multitasking`Khaos> Being a slaves means doing whatever pleases your master, even if it does not please you. Is this what you wish?
[19:32.37] <+girl> yes Mistress.
[19:33.56] <Multitasking`Khaos> So, what if you had a master and he wished for you to only do domestic duties and care for his children and his home, and not to be a sex slave for him? Would you wish it then?
[19:34.56] <+girl> yes Mistress.
[19:35.11] <+girl> But in Gorean law.
[19:35.21] <Multitasking`Khaos> What do you mean Gorean law?
[19:36.52] <+girl> the right to serve, the right, the chance to change the Master, and someone above the Master who protects
[19:37.06] <Multitasking`Khaos> In Gorean law, a slave is property and does what it is told by the master. Maybe it is sex, or maybe it is working in the field and being deprived.
[19:37.11] <Multitasking`Khaos> Slaves have no rights.
[19:37.48] <Multitasking`Khaos> Slaves do not have the right to serve. They do not try to change their master, and they do not have the right to protection.
[19:37.57] <+girl> I know Mistress.
[19:38.03] <+girl> i accept it.
[19:38.20] <+girl> I do not want to be in religious law.
[19:38.22] <Multitasking`Khaos> You are thinking of some kind of fantasy romantic view of slavery. It is not real.
[19:39.18] <+girl> i am realist, Mistress
[19:39.30] <Multitasking`Khaos> If you accept it, then why do you not embrace your desire to serve and be pleasing and use it to try to please your husband the best you can.
[19:40.02] <Multitasking`Khaos> If that means he wishes you to be modest and religious, then you do it, because it is what pleases HIM. That is serving.
[19:40.32] <Multitasking`Khaos> What you keep telling me is how you want to be a slave because of what YOU wanty. Not so you can be what a master wants.
[19:42.44] <+girl> I'm afraid about my life here, husband not love me and not accept , i not want die here as young women. in europe will be better serve Masters
[19:43.04] <+girl> here i not can learn more
[19:44.08] <Multitasking`Khaos> Well, what you need then is a place to find sanctuary - not pretend you wish to be kajira because you do not like the manner in which your husband wishes you to serve and please him.
[19:47.56] <+girl> my husband never affects my desire, I do not lie. I am afraid that he will want to get rid of me because I bring dissatisfaction. He spoke it many times. I was never prepared for the role of a slave, only no one knows and no one even wants to talk to my husband about treating me better. I would like to feel a woman for a moment. get to know real sexuality. I read in books about how a master for being contently submissive as rewarding
[19:47.57] <Multitasking`Khaos> There is a quote from the books that I am trying to find for you.
[19:49.38] <Multitasking`Khaos> Slavery is not about sexual desire. Slavery is about service. It is being whatever and however the owner wishes, no matter what it is that you wish. You are not looking for slavery. You are looking for sexual pleasure.
[19:50.03] <+girl> I serve a man whom I do not know, he does not know me and does not even let me know himself.
[19:51.18] <+girl> I can not grow here I do not know myself after 30 years of life I read something that I did not experience
[19:53.35] <Multitasking`Khaos> Many slaves serve a man they do not know.
[19:53.58] <+girl> I serve as I can but I would like to feel more about myself. I dream about it. but even to the doctor I can not go alone, and she can not talk to me about my needs. more children are born and I have never met sexual pleasure. I can not take it anymore.
[19:54.07] <Multitasking`Khaos> Again, slavery is not what you are seeking. If thet were true, you would serve and be happy to do as it pleases him.
[19:54.42] <Multitasking`Khaos> So stop chasing the idea of slavery. It will not give you what you seek.
[19:55.55] <+girl> and the development of a woman in aconsciousness?
[19:56.40] <+girl> is it bad that I want to belong to another?
[19:57.32] <Multitasking`Khaos> No. It is not bad that you want to belong to another. But that is not what you are describing. You already belong to a man.
[19:58.12] <+girl> I dream that someone would give me a chance to be a real succumbing stage. I want to know my possibilities and not to hear that it is a sin. I want someone to appreciate my body, even entwined with a piece of silk.
[19:58.13] <Multitasking`Khaos> You want to belong to a man who will give you the sort of experiences you crave. And there is nothing wrong with that either. It is simply not slavery.
[19:58.48] <Multitasking`Khaos> But what if he is weak?' she begged. 'Continue to serve him, in the fullness of your slavery, begging him for the least of his kisses, the most casual of his caresses. Even such small attentions, you will discover, now that you have become sensitized to your slavery, will be precious to you.' 'But what if he is stupid?' she asked. 'Beg him to sell you, or give you away,' I said, 'that you may, if only in being sold off on the block, come into the collar of another, one capable of satisfying what you are, a slave.' 'But what if he will not sell me, or give me away?' she said. 'Then,' said I angrily, 'that is how it will be, for it is you who wear the collar. He is the master. You are the slave.''
[19:59.00] <Multitasking`Khaos> This passage is from Magicians of Gor.
[19:59.40] <Multitasking`Khaos> That is an example of Gorean law.
[20:12.32] <+girl> Mistress exuse me. but my husband not is a Master
[20:13.50] <+girl> Maybe Master sets his own law and is not guided by the law of society
[20:15.19] <+girl> i ddi not born in iran and this is not my law
[20:16.54] <+girl> i think that every Master will be better than my husband :( and i want try doing norlam life , i wants GOR law in my life but not in iran
[20:18.20] <+girl> I prefer every service from now on, I can not trust my husband I really prefer dark basements far away from here.
[20:23.37] <+girl> in gorean I would have a chance to change my life and chance to develop myself and get to know the world, I was born as a free man on earth, I want to give my will to the one who surrenders me and let me be submissive on normal terms. I do not want to write about the more intimate detail , Mistress on the general main but I believe that slavery here is worse than Gor.
[20:29.40] * Multitasking`Khaos is now away - Reason : Probably got distracted (idle for 30 minutes)
[20:29.40] * You are now known as AfKhaos
[20:45.34] <+girl> Mistress plz
[20:51.57] <+girl> with Mistress permission, can I leave?
[21:08.48] **** QUIT!! **** ====* girl (xxxchat@3D3FC1F5.327AFFA8.808C6B1E.IP) Quit (Read error) *====

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